First ETC training Tournament: 3-4 november, Sion

Hi Everybody !

I have found a date where the venue in Sion could be available. I wanted to organized it sooner but it appeared to be impossible because the venue was occupied.

I know it's only a week from the Legendary Black Giant and therefore we probably won't have many swiss german players (yet the LBG is only a one day tournament) but I think if we can gather 15-20 players it could be great!

It would be simple. ETC Rules, ETC line of sight, 5 games. Something like 25.- with meals or 10.- without.
I organize everything myself. The lists shall be posted on this forum and we can all correct them (we'll play open lists like at the ETC)

The date is also good for us romands, because otherwise we don't have any tournaments until december.


What do you think?

I'll be there.




Just about daemons: they have no restrictions for the new units. I'd put something like: 0-1 Soul grinder and MAYBE 0-2 Screamers (I already thought about a list with a spam of them to just not give points in close combat..).



For the rest I like the idea. Even if I would let the other training day in Villeneuve for the 20th of october (even if we are 4-5 it will be nice and useful).

The training day in Villeuneuve will most likely take place as well, I just need a confirmation !

And the next one will probably be organized in Swiss german (like end of november?)
Maybe in Bern if Buchi finds something, otherwise he told me we could always go to Zürich.

I'll do something like that for the deamons

I'll be there too!! ^^

About organising a Swiss German training day I can not yet promise a day. November will have the Sion TD already, Dezember will likely have the Swiss Open with ETC rules and its Christmas season so it will be hard to gather people anyway and to get a place at reasonable prices.
I would rather suggest to have some in January and February in several places here in the Swiss German area but have to find organizers willing to do that and people who will go there as representatives as I might not be able to attend due to work (got a big new project that involves quite some travelling to Germany) and family.

I will open a new thread once any date and place is fixed and stop derailing this thread now.

I probably can be there too, I am motivated to do some training and I think it's a great idea to organize some of them already!

Paul

Very interesting results, I have to say and congratulations to the winners!

Could some details be given like matchups and probably any special situations or gamebreakers/deciding moments per match?
Just a few sentences if possible, so that we get a better picture.

Thanks in advance!

So basically, the most important thing to remember is how well the dwarf list scored (although yes, some of the lists that are annoying for them weren't there, such as Ogers)
But I think nevertheless that the list proved its potential, both offensive and defensive.
Paul got 4 victories and a draw (against my Bret, which should have been something like a 12-8 for me without some stupid things of mine and pegasus unable to rally three times in a row ^^)
Antoine got 3 good victories as well and two defeats (8-12 against Khemri and 0-20 mirror against Paul)

My Brets worked fine too, but I don't like the list so much anymore. I think I can do much better.
Maybe I would like to have the KB on horse to make it more useful and safe, and less pegasi (replaced by cheap heros on pegasus) and definitely the horn of fredemond (during four games out of 5 I wished I had taken it with me).
But I liked them very much nonetheless
I was very lucky with my 12-8 against Alan (it should have been like a 11-9 for him, althought it was going worse because he managed a good 11 inches charge on my pegasus) but 5th turn I could luckily kill his Lord of Change with a desesperate D6 S6 from lore of heaven, klling the 4 life points he had left

Victor list worked also pretty well, getting 4 victories and loosing 15-5 against his nemesis list (Paul's dwarves). I think this list could be also considered in our metagame since it has only a few bad match-ups (offensive dwarves for instance). My game against him could have been better; I didn't play perfectly yet he managed to kill me 5 characters thanks to two 12 dices magic phases (second scroll would have been handy against such a list). Like Paul, impressive overall result with a strong list !

About Dim's Empire, we're slowly reaching the optimal list. He lost one game against Paul (him again haha) although it could have been better for him (even if we have an unforgettable comet of cassandora... cast the first turn it fell down during the 6th turn with S14 !
We would here have a perfect army to throw, able to take everything.
The minors changes he thought about was to put the BSB on horse in the pack, switching the crown of command to the warpriest and thus being able to play the level 4 out of the big pack of cavalry (avoiding miscast disaster like happened against Paul)

So to summarize this:

-we have a really strong Dwarf list that Paul handles very well
-our Empire player is getting stronger and so is the armylist
-we also have a strong DE player, I would like to see him testing other things too
-the bret is strong too, but I need to work on the list

Thanks Xavier and I am happy that we got some good insights from the tournament.

Out of interest the 4 victories from Paul, were scorred against which armies/players? Just to see that in comparison to our scoring matrix
( the ++/-- thingy).

About Victors list - would love to see his and your opinion about the roster with a scoring matrix, as imo there are not so few not so good matchups, but I might be mistaken. A short summary of his games would be nice too.

Thanks for the informative summary.
I'm really impressed of the fact, that Pauls list scored so well and congratulate him to the victory .

Would it be possible to post here all the pairings and results? Maybe this would be helpful for doing the pairing matrices.
And of course, I would love to get more feedback from the players. I hope I can join another tournament.

Quickly :

Paul

17-3 against Caspar (Lizardmen)
15-5 against Dim (Empire)
20-0 against Antoine (Dwarves)
15-5 against Victor (Dark Elves)
10-10 against Xavier (Bretonians)

Victor

17-3 against Christophe (Lizardmen)
12-8 against Xavier (Bretonnians)
12-8 against Alan (Deamons)
5-15 against Paul (Dwarves)
18-2 against Heiko (High Elves)

Xavier

18-2 against Thomas (Dark Elves)
8-12 against Victor (Dark Elves)
15-5 against Tiziano (Vampires)
12-8 against Alan (Deamons)
10-10 against Paul (Dwarves)


Of course all those results have to be taken with caution due to the fact that not all players were top skilled and that it's also a game of dice

I Let the other do their own matrix if they want to

Hi everyone!!

Juste to summarize quickly, I played the exact same rooster as Paul, I will just talk about to games.
The first against Paul, I was a perfect mirror match so Paul get a little bite more lucky than me with the shooting part, then I tried to push to see if something is possible but obviously not... ^^
Then against the TK list, the interesting point is that the game went very very bad for me, I lost the anvil on a really lucky shot and my miners get stuck with 20 archers on the flack during 5 rounds, but I still managed to lost only 8-12. Therefore we can see that even if the game is good pretty bad this rooster is though enough not to loose to much points.
The same would have been trough against Paul if I had decided not to push and to hide 5 rounds behind the hill

Eventually it was:
15-5 against Heiko (HE)
20-0 against Kevin (Deamons)
0-20 against Paul (Dwarves)
8-12 against Christian (TK)
20-0 against Thomas (EN)

Cheers,
Antoine

Thanks Xavier and Antoine - your feedback is very much appreciated!

I am impressed by the results, especially from Victor but also from Paul. Matchups were not that easy for them, so good job!

I just want to forget this weekend. Maybe I did some error in some match but dices punished me more that what I deserved.

This tournament gave me back the same feelings I had during the first part of 2012: VIII edition doesn't deserve what an ETC need (money, time and energy).

Summary

I would like to see him testing other things too

Like what ? Dragon?

About Victors list - would love to see his and your opinion about the roster with a scoring matrix, as imo there are not so few not so good matchups, but I might be mistaken. A short summary of his games would be nice too.

Ok, I can do that

First game against christophe (He nearly didn't play since 1/2 years to his credit :p) : His list was not optimal (engine of God, Saurus Lord on Foot, no dispel capacity) and first turn I take The Engine of God with the 0 of death and the lvl2 with the 2 of death.
After that I had just to move and take points.
At the end, he managed to take my hydra and some shadows. He had only his slaan in the temple guards and other smalls units left.

Second game against Xavier : I was (really) lucky with death magic and him with trebuchet xD. At the middle of the game he tryed a double charge with pegasus and lord on the unit of the 2 Lvl4 /1 assassin, he failed with the pegasus (needed a 5^^) and success with the lord (needed 9). He managed to kill the Lvl4 of death and die.

I really think it’s not a good match up for dark elves.

Third game vs. Allan : We both played really causius and I take the 12 because he thought that i would’nd charge his 7 slaanesh beasts with hydra and khaelet (he was in a forest—> no more stubborn). It was a risky charge but I think more risky for him.
I didnt’do anythink with magic and Shouting and allan neither.

Fourth Game versus Paul: Till the 3 turn i was fine: I killed all his rangers and his Than For the prise of 1 Assassin and the lvl4 of death.
But the 4th was a Drama, he uses a reformation trick with his minors to charge my line with the characters And I failed my Ld test at 9 (I was stubborn…), My hydra had to make a test and flew out of the table, and at the same turn I failed a test at 7 rerollable with khaleth.
I managed to take his minors with shadows and crossbowen and a grudge thrower with harpies.

Fifth Game against Heiko: He couldn’t do anythink with his type of list (except not die cause of the magic) and he did not play really well either.

I will do a matrix for this list

My games:

First game against Demons with the Nurgle great deamon.
I still have some difficulties to handle the 30 khorn warriors units because of the killing blow, but otherwise it's pretty okay. The nurgle great demon finished the game with 1LP, so bad, It's a 13-7, but because the demon didn't played well, giving me for instance BSB+horrors instead of letting them back. I suppose normally it's a 10-10, especially if there is no great demon or if it can hide. With less demi-gryphs I just can't handle the khorn warriors.

Second game against Paul
I made a major mistake by placing my big cavalry unit behind a forest. Since I were anviled, I marched into the forest, second mistake, and lost several knights. Then I made irrestible force first turn on the comete, killing more knights and suddenly, there is no more lock out sir... I lost warrior priest +lvl 4 on shooting, then minors in the back, only the grandmaster survived, but was unable to stop fleeing... and died. Then, two swift reform failed in the same turn leads me to get my two units of demi-gryph separated, and they died against the dwarves blocks. on the end of the game, it remains 10 minors and 5 rangers, so the fights could have turn in my favor if I could bring some characters in, and somehow get support.7

The comete came on the last turn and killed anvil + 2 catapults, to go to 5-15. But I think that if I don't loose the big cavalry unit so stupidly, the dwarf has great difficulties to stop me. The dwarf has to deploy on the middle because if not I can outrange him with my cannons, letting possibilities to hunt him with the demi-gryphs, and I can go for the anvil with the grandmaster. So I would say: test again!

Third game against Thomas, difficult because of the metal lore... I'm loosing the demi gryphs 2 by 2, but Thomas came to the close combat, for his bad, and I killed BSB+dark gards with demi-gryphs+warrior priest, and furies with the other unit of demi-gryphs. I should have loosed 8-12 if he keeped on casting his spells, but I get 14-6.

Fourth game against Jonathan, with ogers. I experimented a lack of knights on the big unit (1 remaining on the end of the game) had some luck to kill the big unit with the knights unit. One sabertusk remained alive on the end of the game. 20-0

Fifth game against Tiziano. Very difficult because the table has a place where to hide the terrorgeist and death magic, so I play very defensive. But the VC gives me a charge of my grandmaster on his vampire lord, I kill him with runfang, end of the game, 20-0 (no more vampire model on the end of the game ).

What I learned:

-I didn't missed Steam tank.
-More knights in the big unit, 12 is not enough. At least 14.
-BSB goes in the cavalry unit, have to put the magic resistance to test if it makes a difference against death/metal lore.
-I'm thinking about life lore to prevent miscast desaster, and giving LP back to demi-gryphs... But then I need some other character to cast spells in the first turns...
-I'm also thinking about the celestial huricannum, for the +1 to hit and +1 power dice.

So there are still some work on fiding the actual combination, but...
I will post a new list by the end of the week, I suppose.

Cheers,

Thank you for the reading and the info, well done to all of you