Where are we going to travel in 2013?

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Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Fri 14 Sep - 13:15


Hello !

I has been a month now, the last ETC, and very soon we are going to vote on the new venue location !

So far three proposals have been put forward:

-Munster (Germany) -> same as in 2009 and 2010, we know the place quite well and what it offers. The tables are not great but the organisation is not so bad (however you must be ready to eat Burgerking during the whole weekend Razz ). No air co in the venue as well, which is a very negative point in my opinion, together with the tables. Nevertheless it has the advantage of being quite close by with the car, around 8 hours.
Something else to take into consideration is that the ETc will be split into two smaller event. Namely one WHB weekend, a week of single events and the following weekend the WH40K event. Not that it bothers me, but I think the tournament kind of loses its splendor without the mix of 40K and fantasy players.

-Novi sad (Serbia) -> a small but motivated community with a nice venue, they are the new us !
I've read the bid carefully and it seems to be a pretty decent place ! My only concern is about the terrains but if we could make it being only a handful of people, I guess it's possible for them as well. Moreover Serbia has very low prices on accomodation, food and beers and the venue is reachable by car (a rough 13 hours driving). And they say they can provide room for Fantasy, 40K as well as Flames of War.

-Livadia (Greece) -> here the place may to be reachable by car haha, so we have to take a flight to Athens and a shuttle service will be organized to transport us to the nearby city of Lividia (110km far). The venue has air co as well but unlike Serbia, they also split the event into two weekends as the germans do. The advantage is that Greece might be really cheap as well if they have to break out of the Euro Razz
More seriously (although if this happens, Greece might be indeed ridiculously cheap) the venue seems to be great as well.


My personal opinion with the information we have so far goes in favour of Novi Sad. Greece nevertheless is attracting as well, but they split the event which I think should be avoided as long as we are able to do so.

I would personally enjoy to visit Serbia (Novi Sad is also said to be a nice city), why not going there by car if possible.

What do you think? (if anybody finds himself visiting the forum haha)
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Buchi on Fri 14 Sep - 14:21

Thanks for the info Xavier!

Novi Sad is indeed a nice City with a rich cultural inheritance. One could also add a trip before or afterwards to the Croatian coast, that is quite nice as well and basically on the way, if one goes by car.

Munster has the advantage of the German language for those of us, that speak it and obviously is the closest location.

Personally, I would opt for Munster, as it makes it much easier for me to attend due to family reasons. Taking 3 days off is already hard but if I have to go to Novi Sad, I have to convince my wife for holidays in the region, which might be much more difficult. Laughing


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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  2dipicche on Fri 14 Sep - 14:33

Onestly i'm for a new country (greece is good but maybe a little bit risky at the moment, even if it will be cheaper). I already seen Serbia and I loved it, son for me both of them (Greece and Serbia) are ok.

BUT, if muenster will mean to have the possibility to build a stronger team (with Thomas too) I'll be happy to go there..
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Fri 14 Sep - 15:17


Good argument Alan, the choice will also be influenced by how strong the team will be Smile

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  2dipicche on Fri 14 Sep - 17:25

Xavier wrote:
Good argument Alan, the choice will also be influenced by how strong the team will be Smile


I'd like to try to build the strongest team the Switzerland can have once. But, as I said in the MP I wrote you, this need time and training during the year.
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Dim on Fri 14 Sep - 18:05

Hi guys,

First of all, let's hope we'll effectively travel this time... I'm OK to invest time for the team, but will be really desapointed if it has to end as last year.

About spitting Warhammer/Warhammer 40k /Flames of War, I think this will soon become unavoidable with the expansion of the different events.
With the experience of 3 ETC, the interaction with the other game system is quite small, so the effort for the organizers is not worth it, in my opinion.

Munster has the advantage of a known organizing team, and the other two of cheap venues.
Greece may be a very good place to combine vacations and tournament, so this also should be taken into account.

My vote would go for Munster has it seems easier for some of us to go there.

Cheers,

Dim

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Fri 14 Sep - 19:11

I'm also hoping to have one year the strong Switzerland, we almost had it once but still, now with Alan, John and Grebac we have more possibilities, even if some players like Dima left us.

But this needs that maximum one player gives up beforehand, because we cannot replace players so easily in our tiny coutry and we find ourselves with everybody giving up one after each other due to lack of competitiveness of the team.

We'll discuss that more deeply during Divination !

But I would like to do what we planned to do last year. Now we have a place to gather between Sion and Lausanne (in Villeuneuve), it would be perfect to create some ETC days where people could just gather and play, with ETC lists of course. This would be open to everyone and would allow everybody to train and prove his value, as well as provide some needed training for everyone and test lists.

If we would organize this on a monthly basis, posting all the informations in advance on T3, I think it could be both good for us players (because therefore we could have more fun in playing the game we love and seeing each other) and also for the competitiveness of the swiss team.
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Dim on Sat 15 Sep - 7:03

This seems a good idea.

By the way, can someone lend me some demigryphs/huricanum for Divinasion?
++

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Sat 15 Sep - 8:31


Ask Francois, he played 2x4 demigryphs at the ETC so I guess he should have the painted models Smile
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  2dipicche on Sat 15 Sep - 13:25

I like the idea of the ETC-days but not I would not post it on the T3. The reason is simple: we need good players. Either to test level either to have some training. If we post it on the T3 I'm afraid that the level of players will decrease leaving the test day not believable.

I would do something like: we chose a CT and he has to call the players (who he thinks that could be useful for something like the ETC of course). This way we can organize some training-days full of skilled players.

Imho.
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Sat 15 Sep - 15:51


The thing is, with this you'll never get the overall level to improve. You just leave aside players who might be eager to enhance their playing skills in contact of the best. Otherwise everybody stays in his corner and nobody moves forward.

My idea is, if there's a lack of place then no problem, we can only call the players we (but who is this "we"?) would like to see. But otherwise I don't see any problem by having a ETC day with more people, those being the ones willing to have the opportunity to learn (like the ones who participated this year).
I have been told, when we fucked up all the ETC thing last year and fortunately a new team was willing to represent Switzerland anyway, that they agreed to to put on hastily a new team even though they weren't in the best position to do so because the schedule was tight. But this under the condition they will have their right to speak in the future.

I do believe we made a mistake, and now we should not act like nothing happened and just take back the rules not even thanking the people who went all the way to Poland to represent our country because we weren't able to do it ourselves. Those people have the right to have a chance, and in this way they should not be left over.
Of course for most of them, if our normal ETC players are available, it is going to be difficult to claim a spot in the team, yet not impossible.
But if we want to organize some ETC days like I imagine them, then everybody should be allowed to come and prove his skill (given the amount of tables we can have)

Of course, if we want to make specific testing against strong players, we can always set up a meeting between friends to play warhammer and have a good time. However, my idea is that if we want to make anything sounding like an official ETC day, it should not be restricted to the people Mr X. or Mr. Y is willing to call on.


I think this might do only good, as it might broaden the circle of people interested in the ETC (and they are probably more than we think).
Some years ago we used to laugh picturing Paul Berclaz playing at the ETC, but in 2012 he brought back 69pts being the best swiss player.

Given our failure of last year, I think this should not be an authocray anymore. I think a captain should still represent us and take the hard decisions. We always choose our captain with a gentlemen agreement, and we might do the same this year again if nobody sees an issue and we agree on someone. Otherwise, a vote should happen, among the people who have participated so far in the ETC, to elect a new captain (this is how it works in Germany, but being a small country we may be able to agree upon a choice without voting). We can talk about this issue during Divination and afterward it would be nice to take a choice in order to get the things done.


I would like the opinion of you about this topic Smile




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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Pulps on Sun 16 Sep - 0:07

Hi!

Regarding the ETC 2013 venue it will be nice to see some new places and maybe to spend a couple of days in vacations too. Serbia sounds interesting, easy reachble and cheap...but on the other hand if it would be impossible for Thomas to come then Munster will be also great!

Next year I'll study in Wien, so it will be quite difficult for me to take part at the ETC-training days and all that stuff...Probably I have to see this with the future capitain.

See you

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Gab on Mon 17 Sep - 8:11

I'm totally agree with Xavier about the new players who were going to Gorzow this year, more than everybody, they deserve a chance.

But Xavier : i hate you for divination Smile you wrote on Facebook That you come back during Oktober only, so i thought " ok, i don't go to divination, like That i can go to another tournament during the semester with xavier ". So i Will not play, but i Will be There for see you guys.

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Buchi on Fri 21 Sep - 9:10

Very interesting topic I have to say and great ideas being brought forward!

First - thanks a lot for supporting me for eventually going to Munster - much appreciated! I will plan next years vaccation by the end of this year - so by then, it should be clear, which venue the next ETC will take place. I would recommend to wait with the Swiss vote as long as possible and see which venue has the best chances. If Munster is unlikely to be the place anyway, then go forward and vote for whatever else seems suitable and I will try to arrange for holidays there, even though that might not be too likely Smile

In regard to training days and thereby selection of the team I would say that both approaches (Xaviers and Alans) have their place and advantages.
I absolutely agree, that the "broad" swiss player base needs a) better training and b) a better way to get involved with the ETC. I can tell you, that the Swissgerman part is a bit upset being nearly completely uninformed about the ETC selection (except for the few ETC players themselves) for the last years and there are some people that are at least enthusiastically interested (even though probably not (yet) good enough to actually participate. Also the people who went to Gorzow deserve some credit for that.
In my opinion an option would be the following:
Starting asap there should be the training weekends mentioned by Xavier. They should be open to anybody and should be announced as broadly via all kind of Forums and Networks as possible, so that nobody feels left out. They should also be published on T3 to reach more people, BUT I would recommend to not send in results to T3, as these weekends are meant for training and that will be achieved best, if the top players actually teach their opponents and if bad decissions can be taken back or an exploded Lvl4 is not taken out and so on, so that a closer, more challenging and more interesting game is played. A tournament atmosphere will probably not go well with this.
These weekends should commence until we have to decide for a team. In my opinion it will then suffice that the captain selects the armies that should be played and the most able player for that army at the moment, but if need be, there could also be a weekend, where all candidates with the same armies battle each other in several games to see who is the fittest with that army so that the captain can draw his conclussions.
From then on the training should only be the selected team members plus by the ETC team invited guests like Alan proposed to have a better preparation.


Just a suggestion. Wink

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Buchi on Tue 6 Nov - 12:02

Germany is out of the equation, as they have withdrawn their bid for 2013. Voting for the venue has started now.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Links to the bids can be found in the above linked thread

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  2dipicche on Tue 6 Nov - 17:45


1/ Do you prefer ETC events in 2013 to be held at the same location :
A/ Yes
B/ No, WFB and FoW in Serbia, 40k in Greece.

2/ If option 1/A/ is selected, please chose your prefered bid (presented in alphabetical order) :
A/ Greece
B/ Serbia

A
A


But you have to convince me that wh deserve the efforts that etc need.
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Thu 8 Nov - 15:32


Personally I would prefer Serbia (I'm scared that subitely the venue won't have airco and we'll simply die from the heat Razz ) but Greece would do it as well.

But I don't care so much, so I would say diplomatic vote.
We wait until the end of the vote, and we choose the obvious winner (neutral way)

What are the other opinions?


But you have to convince me that wh deserve the efforts that etc need.

If you need to be convinced to spend a weekend with friends drinking cheap beers and playing warhammer (on top of that you'll either have greek beaches or serbian bitches, and I have been told both are wonderful Very Happy ) well, then I dunno what to respond... Wink
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Biboun on Thu 8 Nov - 18:54

I know that I'm saying this in relationship with a bid in Serbia, BUT :

I really think Greece is an unsure venue, with an uncertain ETC future... We have little idea of what will be the state of this country in a year or so, imo.

Cheers,

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  ledwarfou on Thu 8 Nov - 21:48

I agree with biboun, I mean maybe Greece will be China next year so... affraid

And Serbia bitches are kind of interesting as well ^^

Just saying cheers

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Thu 8 Nov - 22:31


Well, I think Greece would be really happy to have the economic forecast of China for the following months Razz

I don't think that would be an issue, except in keeping the prices much lower in case they give up the euro.
600 players bringing 200 euros each to the economy at least (talking about more than 100'000 euros) I'm guessing think politicians from this small city wouldn't mind us coming Smile

So, as long as we provide the money ourselves to their economy, I don't see how things could possibly go wrong (the only bad thing would be a strike from transport or airport staff, that would be really bad indeed Laughing )

I would simply recommend to our german speakers to not talk out loud ^^
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  ledwarfou on Fri 9 Nov - 9:58

I don't think that would be an issue, except in keeping the prices much lower in case they give up the euro.
600 players bringing 200 euros each to the economy at least (talking about more than 100'000 euros) I'm guessing think politicians from this small city wouldn't mind us coming

you're right, they will be really happy according to the fact that this represent something like 10% of their PIB ^^ affraid

I would simply recommend to our german speakers to not talk out loud ^^

hahahahahahahahahhahaha Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Biboun on Fri 9 Nov - 21:12

Main risk is a massive riot, people against Government, and getting caught in the middle Wink

I won't take that option!

Cheers,

Biboun
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Dim on Fri 9 Nov - 22:18

Don't be too dramatic, guys.

The real problem is a possible strike in the airport on the crucial days, cancelling everything.
You won't be in danger in Greece until the extreme right-wing party has not made a coup d'etat. And this won't happen in the two days we are there.

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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Xavier on Sat 10 Nov - 1:32

Please, you take more risks walking on the "Place de la Riponne" than in anywhere in Greece Razz

You've never seen a real riot haha, no risk to be taken in between, I can promise that Smile

Go to India and take the train in popular class... then it would take more than a bunch of angry greeks to scare you off ^^
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Re: Where are we going to travel in 2013?

Post  Dim on Sun 11 Nov - 18:12

In all case, it's 16-7 for Serbia for now, and there is no reason that the tendancy will change much. So it's practically sure that we'll go to Serbia.

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